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Welcome to Make More Money without Selling Your Soul with me Polly Lavarello, evergreen marketing expert. This podcast is for you if you are an online entrepreneur who is looking to simplify their business to scale.  On this podcast you can expect to hear regular talk about wealth, about selling and about wellbeing. Because I believe these three core fundamental things are pivotal to your growth moving forward.

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Hello and welcome to make more money without selling your soul with myself. Polly Lavarello, everyday sales expert and cushy business pioneer.  Today on the show, we have a guest Nikki St Paul. Nikki is a mind, body and breath coach and the founder of breathing mindful coaching. She is a certified life and breath Coach and an accredited mindfulness meditation teacher. Nikki supports women in business who are always on to speed up by slowing down, pausing and resting to achieve sustainable success and thrive in business and beyond. Nikki is on a mission to redefine rest and success. There is power in the and resting and rising. I am so excited, on a personal level, to have Nikki on the show because she is one of the resident experts inside the cushy business incubator where you are supported for 12 months to learn how to make sales every day. And Nikki is an integral support piece to ensure that you are scaling in a way that is sustainable where you are not forgetting that success is an everyday feeling, so that you finish the time being supported by us with not only a business that looks great, but feels great too. So I’m really excited to dive into a conversation today with Nikki, where you can learn more about the importance of rest. Hello and welcome to the show, Nikki. I am so excited to be having this conversation with you before we get started. For my listeners who haven’t yet discovered your amazingness, who are you and what do you do? Oh, thank you so much, Polly for having me on the on the podcast. Excited to have this conversation. So yes, to answer your question, I am a mind, body and breath coach and a founder of breathing mindful coaching. You may think, what the heck is a mind, body and breath coach?

What’s one of those when they’re at home? But essentially, it is a real amalgamation of a number of my skills, my passions, and the way that I work with clients. So I combine, like life coaching, breath coaching, mindfulness, other somatic and nervous system regulation tools. Bit of a tongue twister there. And I support female founders and leaders who they want to build momentum in their business. They want to get financial freedom. They want flexibility, to take the day off when it feels right, but they want to do it without burning the heck out and being, you know, like a fake Duracell, something that’s not lasting that long, so that that’s really what I help people to do. I love that, and I was sharing with Nikki earlier, before we hit record, about the fact that you know, one of the reasons why what Nikki does is so important, and why I’m so excited for you, dear listener, to be listening to this conversation, is because burnout is something I experienced personally, and to be honest with you, I don’t even really like to talk about it in the past tense, because I feel like once you’ve experienced it, you’re not living alongside it, but you’re constantly aware of the habits and behaviors that could steer you back into that situation again. But I, you know, experienced the severity of what burnout can do to you, and as a parent to two small children, it really, really impacted us and beyond that. So anyway, before we get into any of my own story, let’s talk briefly about burnout, Nikki, before we talk about all the wonderful things that rest enables us to have, I feel like burnout is a word that’s thrown around far too casually these days, to the extent that, you know, I don’t think people necessarily understand what it is or how they may identify if they have it. They might just be feeling tired one day, so I’m feeling burnt out. So what are they a genuine indicators that somebody is potentially living alongside or at risk of burning out? And I think it’s like one of those things, like stressed. When people say that they’re feeling really stressed, often, these things are on a continuum, yes, and they might start very, very mild, and they might show up physically, in terms of feeling like, even though you’ve had an amazing night’s sleep, if you’ve managed to do that, actually still waking up feeling like you haven’t actually rested. Yeah, and a lot.

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Of the times people find that their body then shows up certain illnesses, certain signs that actually the immune system isn’t able to cope with, it’s normal things that it can normally bat off and get through. So you find sometimes people find that shows up in their skin, in how often they’re getting certain colds, and also in terms of their ability to handle like the day to day stresses of life. Yeah, whether that just be being more irritable, finding that their patience is wearing thinner than normal, finding that they’re forgetting things, finding that they’re things which they normally would kind of breeze through, just feel so much harder. And sometimes people who often find themselves in this state at some point on the continuum, they’re doing work which they love, yeah, so they want to keep going. So it’s not necessarily that they dislike what they’re doing, although some people may well do fallen out of love with it, falling out of favor with it. But sometimes we’re doing work that’s like, has a real mission, has a real purpose, and so because of that, we just want to keep going. So it’s emotional, it’s physical, and it’s mental feelings of overwhelm, overload, and often it can be very extreme that can cause people to be out of action for weeks, months. And as you say, it’s like one of those things that once you have been there, it’s constantly thinking, how can I ensure that I don’t go back to that place? Because some people do find themselves back where they say that they would never be. Yeah. I mean, definitely certain types of personalities are more prone to it. So if you are the kind of person who associates your external achievements with your own sense of, you know, self-worth and validation, you can be very at risk, and this is something that I’m going to be very vulnerable and say, something I have to be very mindful and aware of. You know, when you’ve grown up a certain way, it’s not one of those things you can necessarily, easily just switch off and even where you can chip away at layers of it and gradually build that self-worth, that little sneaky things in life that can come around, little curve balls, which can really knock you sideways and and make you realize how much more growth and work there is to be done. I think one of the things I’ve also become really aware of recently when it comes to burnout, having designed my business to be spacious, to work less hours, to do the work that I thoroughly enjoy, is that what I’ve recognized that I need to be careful of with my own burnout risks, is parental burnout is, you know, looking after two additional needs children. You know that that has a huge strain on, you know, but it’s, it’s still a similar pattern of essentially, where I’ve not prioritized myself and my own wellbeing, and I’m looking at my happiness through the lens of keeping my children happy.

So I think this is such a valuable conversation. And one of the things I love about what you do, Nikki, is that one of the things I felt that would help me with burnout was only addressing the underlying kind of causes in terms of who I am and how I perceive myself to be. I only started to feel better when I unlocked the things that you support clients with, around breath work, around somatics, around, you know, all the things that don’t require talking or any trauma probing. And, you know, yeah, and so, I mean, it’s Mind Blow. Could you share a bit more about that for anyone who’s new to somatic work. Who doesn’t understand what I’m talking about here? Would you mind expanding upon breath work and all this other amazing somatic work that you do to support people with their nervous system? I think one of the things that’s really important is that we have a mind and we have a body, and often they are not connected. They are very disconnected. We’re living a lot in our heads. We’re always thinking about what we haven’t done, what we’re yet to do, planning, scheming, formulating our kind of master plan. And this is all very good, but actually the body holds a lot of wisdom. But when we’re not used to tuning in to some of the signals, the signs, the messages, however we want to call it that the body is always sending us all the time, we become less able to listen. So the more that we don’t practice listening, the harder it is to listen. And what do I mean by listen? It can be just little signs that actually you need to meet your needs in a certain way. Maybe you are even just taking it really simply. You’re thirsty, you’re cold, you need to use the bathroom, like something as simple as that that we ignore. We’re like, Oh, I’m not really needing to use the bathroom. I’ll just wait another hour. It’s like, hang on a minute. Like the signs are there. And you may think, Oh, that’s really, really small. What does it really matter? Well, what are we saying to ourselves if we identify that we have a need and we say, Oh, that’s not important, right? Now, this thing that I need to send is really important, yeah. And so there will always be exceptions, right? They’re things. When you’re like, you have to just attend to something. But actually, if we’re regularly doing that on a daily basis, ignoring our own basic human needs that we need to survive, it’s another signal that’s like, Oh, you don’t.

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Really matter, Nikki, like you’re not that important. These other people who have sending you things they matter and you don’t. I love this. I love you know, one of the reasons why I love this is I feel like through gradual work that I’ve been doing in these areas, it shifts your identity. It does shift your relationship with yourself. So where I thought I needed to shift my relationship with myself, to shift my patterns, actually, like you said, just simply slowing down and tuning in. So one tiny example of this is I was at a hotel on the weekend, a very nice hotel, and I used the hotel buffet coffee, and it was disgusting, and I just thought, This is my one coffee of the day. I’m very sensitive to caffeine, so I can’t have more than one, and I’m not enjoying this. And there was a little voice in my head that was singing, push it down. Ignore it. Everyone else is drinking this horrible coffee. You can drink it too. And I had two or three more sips, and I thought, I can’t do this. But yeah, I basically had a moment where I recognized there would be minimal expense to the man, I had to ask, please, can I have a nice coffee? And for me, it was honoring one tiny piece of myself. But in doing that, I actually had a moment as I looked at I had some other people I’d just met at this networking event, at this table with me, and one of them almost had their jaw down at the table looking at me, thinking, you know, who is this woman putting someone out and asking for what she wants. And I looked at her, and I saw a previous version of myself. I looked at her, and I thought that used to be me, where I wasn’t willing to advocate for what I wanted and needed, even if I don’t need, I didn’t need an iced coffee. But what would I be telling myself if I made myself either ignore something I really wanted? And this sounds so privileged, and it is privileged, but it is these tiny little micro moments with ourselves, yes, where we choose to honor what we need and what we desire and not suck it up or not judge it based on what other people are willing to tolerate. Yes, but listen to what we need, and I can see how that influences so many other decisions and areas of my life and business, which the old version of me that burnt out didn’t do exactly. I mean, imagine if this lady who was looking upon you as you ordered your nice coffee. It might have made her think. It might have made her think later on, maybe it’s okay for me to ask for something that I want, that I think is an inconvenience. So sometimes it takes a little while for someone to sort of settle in what they’ve seen and heard, and it makes it okay. Yeah, so yeah, to answer the rest of your question about the breath and the amazing thing is, is that the messages that go from body to brain, 80% of those messages go from body to brain, rather than from brain to body. Amazing, and that’s important, because the breath is the one thing that can impact our nervous system that we can actually control. Because we can’t control our digestion, we can’t control our blood pressure directly, but we can control our breathing. We can slow it down, we can speed it up, we can we can really change the rate and the speed of our breath as well as we can just leave it ticking along in the background, right? So which is what’s happening right now as we’re speaking? And that’s important, because when we slow down our breathing, we are telling our nervous system or body that it’s safe and that it’s okay and that we’re okay, and that even if we’re doing a really stretchy action that feels like you know the world’s gonna end. But it’s not by telling our nervous system that it’s safe for us to step into this stretchy moment

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that allows us to do it with more ease. It doesn’t make it easy. It doesn’t mean that it’s going to turn out the exact way that we want it, but we’re going to be able to do it without feeling like actually, this sort of heightened state of hyper vigilance and stress and panic, because we’re doing something like recording a podcast for the first time, going on a stage for the first time, and so the breath is like a gateway for us to be able to impact our state and our state matters as people running businesses like how we show up, who we are being, will fundamentally transmit energy through the page, through the screen, on stages. And it’s the difference between us, like being amazing and just being kind of just, okay, yeah, yeah. And you know what? I love hearing everything you’re saying. And I really, really want anyone who’s listening to really receive this? Because I know from my own personal experience that I used to be I think it almost sounded too good to be true. It felt a bit like well, if breath could help me already, why is it not done that? And one of the really powerful things that controlling and managing my breathing did for me, I’d say control.

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Or managing, but using breath exercises was back in 2020, before I properly burnt out. I had a horrible stint with IBS, and I tried every diet on the planet. And I tried absolutely everything, until I finally met a nutritional therapist. She was the first person to say, this is a stress related thing, you know. And I had realized I thought it was something else eating or I didn’t think. I never imagined in a million years that my body could start essentially combusting because of my lack or because of the stress I was living with. You know, I’d just gone through a divorce, I’d moved countries, I had two very small kids. There was a lot going on, and I started box breathing in the morning and in the evening, and I think only for three minutes or five minutes at a time, not very long, just when I woke up and when I went to sleep. And this was as a single parent with kids. So anyone who says they haven’t got time, we can always find the time, and maybe even ignoring my children for a moment or two while I breathe, which actually started a great conversation with them. They now know a lot more about this stuff than I ever did growing up. What are you doing, Mommy? Yeah, exactly. Yeah, honestly, my son now says, If I need to tell my body I’m safe, I breathe through my nose like, that’s his little kind of mantra,

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because we’ve learned these things. But it did it like that situation went away, the IBS went away. Didn’t solve the burnout issues, but it was, you know, it really, really opened my eyes to so much and breath work sessions that I’ve tried since, I mean, the catharsis through breath work. Can we talk a bit more about breath work? For anyone who’s not experienced breath work, yeah, and I think it’s a little bit like yoga breath work. So there are many types of breath work. You know, you’ve got Hatha Yoga, you’ve got vinyasa, you’ve got all these different types of yoga in the same way you’ve got different types of breath work. So there’s some breath work that’s functional, and it’s the sort of breath work that gets you from breathing in a way that’s not helping your well being, to a way that’s functional, to a way that allows you to be well. And then there’s breath work that really helps to sort of regulate the nervous system. Then there’s breath work that’s conscious, connected breath work, which is more about that kind of emotional release. And often you’ll find that people find that they’re in this sort of state of almost like a trance. And they really do get to release through tears, through shaking, through all sorts of things that the body does to really connect to the conscious mind and release. But the sort of breath work that I do is more on the functional nervous system, regulation side, amazing. All of it has its benefits. So I’m not here to say this is good and this is bad, but the reason I really like the work that I do is because it’s something that you can do at your desk. You can do it when you’re queuing up. You can do it when you’re about to go on set, on stage, or whatever you have going on. It’s really about simple breathing exercises, mindful exercises, exercises that help to activate the vagus nerve, which is like the main nerve that really helps to get into that rest and digest. So it’s really just about changing the rate and the speed of your breath, often slowing it down, but sometimes poly speeding it up.

Yeah, sometimes we need the energy boost. We need the cortisol, the adrenaline to, like, get into our system. Because we’re like, so lazy that we’re kind of, if I don’t even want to say the word lazy, we’re so laid back at that moment that we’re lying down. So we need to get the energy up, the heat up. I think it’s really powerful as well to find a facilitator who you trust and who can guide you. Because I’ve tried different types of breath work. And I, you know, when I tried the Wim Hof app, I remember just feeling very dizzy and very confusing thing. This is a bit too much for me and not wanting to re, re approach it. And then I’ve tried longer, deeper ones, which I think are the ones which kind of, like, you say, almost put you in a trance. And I found that very healing. Actually, there were definitely things that being neurodiverse, I think sometimes we’re very good at not knowing how to process our emotions very well. And I found breath work was a great way to manage that. But equally, being someone who can have a pretty heightened nervous system, what you’re talking about, which I haven’t tried much of, and I definitely want to try. I do recognize, if I’m going to be speaking, or anything like that, the importance of breath. And in fact, funnily enough, as someone who’s aspiring to do more public speaking in the next year or so, I think I need, I need to talk to you more about those things, obviously, like it can even help us to get to sleep at night. And we know the importance of sleep. Matthew Walker has done an amazing job telling us about why we need sleep. Yeah, and so even just as simple for your listeners, breathing in for four through your nose, breathing out for eight, just extending your exhale so that it’s double the length of your inhale, that simple technique, 10 breaths in for four, out for eight, if you can manage eight that can really help to tell your body it’s okay to switch off, it’s okay to rest and digest. And I think that people think it needs to be something massively complex. Yes, it can just be something very simple. Yeah, no, we live in this world, don’t we? Of constant distraction. I mean, you.

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Even if you’re not, even if you don’t work in a way that’s kind of requiring you to hustle. I find the sheer amount volume of WhatsApp messages I receive every day, the amount of school pings I receive every day, the inbox that’s overflowing, and all these other there’s so many demands on our attention. So often when my children go to bed, I then go to do something nice with my partner, like watch something or play a board game or or something kind of gentle to kind of ease into the evening. And so often I have to say, I’m really sorry, but I need to respond to all these WhatsApps. I’m ignored all day, and it can feel like we have so many demands on us all the time. And interestingly, when I first became interested in the nervous system. I remember reaching out to a friend who I, you know, was kind of well versed in all of this stuff. And I said, What books should I read on the vagus nerve? I really want to learn more. And she kind of laughed at me and said, that’s your problem, Polly, you want to learn about this isn’t about learning that taught me.

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I love that answer, and it is, it is about doing. It’s about trying different things and seeing what difference it makes. So something as simple as, if you find that you’re feeling overwhelmed and stressed and you’re literally running from room to room at top speed, try slowing down, yeah, literally. Try slowing down your movements. And sometimes you’ll notice almost an immediate shift in how you feel, or even if you like, putting the dishes away in the kitchen, and you find you’re like reaching frantically to put it all away. Do you really have to go at that speed? It seems really simple,

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but actually it’s extremely effective. And I think even if you’re sat at your chair and you’re like leaning forward, almost touching the screen, can you lean back? Can you drop your shoulders? Can you soften your jaw? Like is these small things that tell the body that there isn’t anything that it needs to be trying to save you from Yeah. So would you say that symptomatic of someone who’s kind of bulldozing themselves towards burnout or at risk of it, that that sense of urgency, that sense of rushing things, is that one of the things that would help somebody, if they’re listening to this right now, thinking when we when we’re talking about stress when we’re talking about physical symptoms. Am I at risk? LIKE, Would you say that’s one of the kind of warning signs that they may be so I think what we’re essentially talking about is fight and flight when you’re really trying to either run away or run towards something, and if you are always on, if you even when the laptop gets switched off, you’re still, like, whirring away thinking about the things, about all the things that you didn’t do. After a while, that constant activation of your kind of sympathetic nervous system, your fight and flight, will start to take a toll. All that build up of those hormones that don’t need to be being built up, and remember, they’re not being used because there is no real threat. So it’s not that you’re fighting a saber tooth tiger. You fought him, and then that’s it. All the energy has been dispelled. It’s just kind of like building up and storing up, and that’s when you then get the physical symptoms and the emotional symptoms that can lead you on that road that we’d rather not be on. Yeah? So I think it’s if you find that you you’re never really switching off, you’re always feeling wide and tired, you’re always feeling like either anxious, worried or quite frustrated and angry,

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then these are signs that they’re not definitives, but they’re just things to think about. Yeah, yeah. And I think it’s so relevant, and particularly for the kind of people who tune into this podcast, because when you run an online business, there’s never, you know, there’s no shops closed, there is no off switch, no. There’s always something to be distracted by, and there’s always, unfortunately, always more that we can be doing. It doesn’t mean you need to be doing it doesn’t mean the more we can be doing is actually going to move the needle. But particularly if you’re in a situation where you’re not seeing the results you’re usually getting, the temptation can be to do more, right?

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That’s it. More. Doing more may not give you more of what you want. Yes, because that seems like, Oh, why? Why not? It just, doesn’t it? Just, I almost wonder if people can sense this. Okay, I’ve launched this campaign. It’s not working. Let me do 10 million more of the things that I’ve already been doing. Yeah, and this panic starts to rise, and then you’re not going to be able to tap into your prefrontal cortex, your logical, brilliant brain that has able to come up with the ideas and solve the problems. You’re going to be in your more prehistoric brain of survival, yes, where it’s just about running on autopilot, like you’re.

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Not going to be able to access your brilliant mind, yes, when you are just frantically rushing around, yeah. And I really relate to this, because what I found is, you know, in supporting myself to be regulated, and I’m not going to pretend I’m perfect at this, so definitely there are occasions where I can see that I’ve not been doing it as well as I should be. The difference is now I prioritize. I’m willing to take time off. If I have to take a week off, I will take a week off, you know, I will do, you know, or like, I’ll cancel podcasts when I wasn’t feeling great. You know that we cancel that session, you know, which I regretted doing. But I know that if I, you know, as a personal brand, if I don’t prioritize my health and well being, then nothing else actually works, you know. And all those private clients who reliant on me being at my best to support them can’t rely upon that, and that’s no good. But previously, when I wasn’t regulated, and when I was hoping, you know, when I was going with the whole like, well, when I’m successful, then I will have more balance. Then I will take breaks. That version of me would overwork, over deliver, not in a healthy way, not in a needed way, in a you wouldn’t be expecting this, but I’m still gonna do this, and you’re gonna love me even more. I wanna work with me forever. And that would set a really weird power dynamic, a really ugly power dynamic with that client, and it would always end up ugly, and then I would be more worn down, more tired, more dysregulated, more stressed, more anxious, getting evidence of the fact that I’m not worthy, because look at how people are Treating me. And it did take, you know, I think this is what’s interesting, is you can make it be something about your identity. You can make it be something about you. And when actually, I simplified it down and realized no boundaries actually need to be boundaries, not words, not things i stipulate in a contract, they need to be the things I live by.

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And maybe some, in some cases for me, that was a little and building upon that, rather than an overnight, because that felt dysregulating to suddenly, like switch overnight. So it was kind of gradual, but eventually I ended up being, you know, a year later, I was like, Who is this woman who, you know, is maintaining these boundaries? Yeah, and I think it’s important in this conversation to be honest about that, though, because I think in the past, I would look at people who would ask for the coffee that they really wanted, or for the person who would be boundaried enough to ignore my message late on a Friday and wait till Monday or Tuesday to reply to me, and I would think, good for them. That’s not me. I can’t do that. So I think, you know, if there is anyone out there who is having those kind of doubts and concerns because, because that was me, and I don’t want them stuck in that way, what would you say to that person who kind of feels like, that person who has boundaries, that person who allows themselves to rest, to have balance, to nurture themselves? You know, that’s a luxury I can’t afford right now, for anyone who’s feeling that way, what would you say to them? I think if we can start to see rest as a strategy, it’s a strategy to our success. Now I’m not saying we rest so that we can do more work, because I’m not in favor of that, yes, but rest is a key ingredient to your success. And that sounds really cliche and corny, but it’s absolutely true. And so if we can start to see that, if we can, as you said, you started small with your boundaries, it’s the same with rest. And in fact, I would argue that if you’re saving all of your rest for your two week break to Greece or wherever you might be going, to Bali, or wherever you might be going, what happens to the other 50 weeks of the year? Yeah, what are you doing then? Like, by the time you get to Bali on week 50, like, how much of yourself is there? And so this is why we need to have micro moments of rest. And I think, Polly, I know you’re wanting me to speak very briefly about the fact that rest is not just sleeping and sitting around watching episodes of something on Netflix, there’s much more to that. Yes, yeah, no. 100%

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I mean, rest isn’t just doing that. I would love for you to expand what other kind of what other forms of rest are there, aside from the one that we all know about, which is like lying down or chilling out and watching Netflix, exactly so that’s physical rest, napping and sleeping. But there’s also mental rest. There’s how do we rest the mind? How do we unplug? How do we allow it not to be so overwhelmed by pings, dings and rings, and that can be as simple as like, turning things down, turning the brightness down, turning the sound off, not having things coming up on the screen at certain times, airplane mode, having noise canceling headphones, like whatever works for you, to help your mind to just zone in, and I would say, also doing one thing at a time, not having like 50 billion tabs open. I know that’s hard. So physical, mental, there is create.

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Of rest, find something that you enjoy, not something that you’re trying to get good at, so that you can make a business of it, because everything doesn’t have to be a business. And I think that’s important, like we can have a creative hobby that we’re not trying to turn into a side hustle, yes. So whatever that, whatever that is for you, experiment, try it. And then I would say the other one is really about social rest. And sometimes social rest means that you might be called, quote, unquote, anti social, right? So that means that you, maybe you’re finding time for yourself, or maybe you craving, because you’ve been in the house for the whole week, you’re craving social connection, yeah. And what does that look like for you? And then also spiritual rest, that may be religious for some people, but for others, it’s meditation, sitting in stillness, going on a walk without, you know, any podcast, or speaking to anybody. And then sensory rest, I think, is the other one that I’ve missed out. Like, how can you have lovely smells nice, sounds nice, things to touch, like warm, cozy clothing like that, can be restful, yeah, as well as napping and sleeping. So hopefully I’ve covered most of them. But yeah, there are seven types. I didn’t make this up. This is Dr Sandra Dalton Smith, who coined this whole idea of seven types of rest. I love that. I love that. Funnily enough, actually, it was really great and miserable yesterday, and I lit a candle, I got my essential oils on. I’ve got a lovely little furry throw on the back of my seat, and kind of creating a nice sensory space, you know, just taking five minutes to slow down and ensure that my room felt cozy and nourishing. Really set the tone for a wonderful day. Another little hack I’ll share, based on what you just shared then is last Christmas, I wanted to be around my children, but I also didn’t want to get sucked into all the kind of hyper, up and downness that can happen around that time of year. So I simply got 1000 piece puzzle. And sometimes the kids would join me, sometimes they wouldn’t, but I found it such a lovely kind of calming, regulating thing that was massively satisfying for me, but also not overly anti social, because I was doing it around everyone else, and it just felt like I was like, what a nice little life hack to have found a way to kind of be present around my family, not be entirely disengaging, hidden behind, you know, a device or something, but to be doing something that, you know, it gave me such a sense of satisfaction doing it. And I love puzzles,

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or like adult coloring, you know, if you like that kind of thing, yeah? And I’ve just ordered a sewing kit because I yeah, I think yeah, finding time for the things that you say that the only thing that’s frustrating when you said the whole don’t do it for business, frustratingly whenever I do the things I love and enjoy the great business ideas always drop in.

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But you know what that is? That’s okay if you are doing something that’s outside of that, and then your mind suddenly has this ability to think and come up with maybe the problem that you’ve been trying to solve for the whole week. Suddenly you’re doing some sewing, and then there it is, the answer, yeah, I guess it’s that sense, right? And when you’re regulated, these things can drop in. And I often say to people, your best ideas will not land when you’re at your desk. It’ll be when you go for that walk, or when you have that shower or when you have that hot bath. And that’s not a reason to do those things, but the reason should be for your own pleasure product.

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Oh, this has been such an illuminating conversation, and one of the reasons why, of course, Nikki, I invited you to be an intrinsic part of my business incubator, because I believe it to be such an important piece as growing as a CEO to to look after ourselves. You know that I was at a summit this weekend, and I wish I could remember his name. I feel like it was Simon Alexander, but he referenced the fact that when people buy into you as a personal brand, they buy into your energy. And so while we shouldn’t just we should never just look at this through the lens of look after your energy to make more money, because we deserve it regardless. But I also think if anyone is thinking, Oh, but I’ll lose money if I spend time looking after myself, you will make much better business decisions when you are regulated. You will be happy and healthy when you’re not working and genuinely present with your friends and family and yourself. You’ll not forget who you are in the mix of things, because I have been the person who hustled my way to a 25k month and got there and thought, what was this all for? So, you know, money is not success. It is how you feel every day. What was the other piece again? And this is the piece that, you know, energy. You know, we are our personal brand, and if we are depleted, not able to function, hiding away, then it’s not going to work. So, but yeah, I mean, I know your angle will be slightly different. I’m still slightly business focused and like, this is why rest is so important. But no, I mean, I think for me, you said it really well earlier on, when we were talking about the fact that we measure our worth by our work, and that’s just the society that unfortunately, many of us.

35:00

Grown up within, whether that’s family, culture, education, you know, you are measured by, oh, well done. You did a really good job with that thing. And we all want to belong, and so if belonging means to work, then we just keep on working. But if we realize that we are worthy inherently, and that doesn’t mean that we can’t work or shouldn’t work, but if we can just attach that a little bit, it just means that we might be less inclined to do the extra when it isn’t even needed. Yes, yes, yeah. And I think it’s no coincidence that the most successful business owners I see in the online space and in the world are the most regulated, the ones who are doing the least, and the the little they do is so impactful. And in the meantime, they are living out their lives and enjoying themselves. Oh, Nikki, this is such a beautiful conversation. So obviously, I’ve already referenced the fact that Nikki is a resident expert for the rest clinic inside the cushy business incubator, which I’m so delighted she’s there. There are already some incredible kind of recordings you could dig into trainings from Nikki, where you’d learn so much already if you were to join us. But beyond that, Nikki, if anyone has been listening today, thinking breathing and somatics and nervous system work, this all sounds like something that would be incredibly beneficial to me. Where can they find you?

36:22

So they can find me? On Instagram at breathing mindful LinkedIn. Nikki, St Paul, I’m on there fairly regularly, and I am doing this kind of work with women all the time, just helping them to breathe, to lead and to thrive and to be able to identify what is my state right now, what symptoms are coming up, and what the heck can I do with it? What are the tools that I can do to get myself out of survival states and into that, as you say, that regulated state? So, yeah, definitely come and chat to me if you’re interested in that work. I love that phrase, breathe, lead and thrive. Yes. Yes. Yes, amazing, amazing. Thank you so much for your time today, Nikki. Thank you, Polly. Take care. You too, well friends. I am obsessed with that conversation we just had. I’ve just wrapped it up with Nikki and said, I want more more conversations like that, please, because this is such an important conversation on so many levels, the dangers of burnout is real, and on the flip side of that, what we enable for ourselves, what we make possible for ourselves, when we truly, genuinely listen to ourselves and honor ourselves and take care of ourselves

37:42

is literally like night or day in terms of the levels of success you can achieve. So whether it’s the motivation to move away from the genuine risks of burnout, which are really severe, or what it makes possible when you genuinely listen to your mind and your body and you take care of yourself. There are so many reasons to be motivated to check out Nikki’s work or come and join us inside the cushy business incubator where you’ll get the support from both myself and her. Anyway, if you found today’s conversation valuable, if you know there’s somebody among your kind of following or among your friends who would really value from hearing this conversation. Please do share this conversation. Please do tag us. And if you enjoyed today’s episode, of course, drop us five-star review below. We always love to know we are making an impact with this podcast. Alrighty, well, I’ll be back in your ears again next week, continuing the mini-series on how to make sales every day. I’ll be in your ears then.