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Welcome to Make More Money Without Selling Your Soul. The podcast for bold entrepreneurs ready to simplify scale and reclaim their time. I’m Polly Lavarello, Evergreen scaling strategist and cushy business pioneer. Join me and my occasional guests as we explore the themes of wealth, selling and well-being, because building a business that works for you changes everything. Let’s dive in.

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Hello and welcome to the show. If you’ve ever found yourself buried in to do’s wondering when you’ll finally feel like the CEO of your own business. This episode was recorded for you today. I’m joined by my guest and client, Kate Lenihan, founder of Rise High Consulting, and a hiring and delegation expert who helps overwhelm solopreneurs make their very first and very strategic hire with over a decade of experience in online marketing, Kate’s worked behind the scenes of powerhouse brands like Amy Porterfield and Sue B Zimmerman, as well as with a leading virtual staffing agency. And in this candid conversation, I’m going to be keeping it real too, sharing some of my own biggest hiring mistakes as we explore how to hire like a pro instead of just delegating, chaos VAs can be one of the best art return on investments in your business. But equally, when you get it wrong, they can also be the biggest time drain and biggest waste of money ever. By listening today’s episode, you’re going to avoid making some of the enormous mistakes I have made across the years. So if you are craving more time, stronger systems and a business that runs even when you’re off the clock, and you know, I’m a big fan of that, then buckle up. This conversation is for you. 

Welcome Kate to the show. I am so excited to be talking about hiring today. And if you’re not excited to be hearing about hiring today. Just sit still and pay attention, because you need to hear this. But anyway, Kate, for anyone who’s new to you, please introduce yourself to my listeners. Oh, hi, Polly, thank you so much for having me. I’m Kate Lenihan. I’m the founder of Rise Hire consulting. I have been in the online marketing world for over a decade, and I’ve really had the privilege of working with so many small business owners, and one of the things that I saw was that small business owners doing it all themselves, are burning out and get stuck. They get stuck being able to scale to that next level, whether it’s financial or productivity or service, whatever it is. And so I help these small business owners find that hire onboard and train their very first virtual assistant successfully. I love that. And you mentioned that you’ve been in the online business space for a decade. So what was it particularly about hiring that really stood out to you as the kind of avenue to go down? I think the thing that really stood out to me about hiring is that small business owners, we’re a special breed, right? Entrepreneurs, we’re a special breed, and we take pride in starting the business, fueling our passion and building something that will serve others. 

Where people were getting stagnant was when they got to a point and they weren’t able to do what they loved and what they were uniquely equipped for, and instead had to do all the admin and the invoicing, the accounting, the social media, the parts that they didn’t enjoy or that they weren’t good at. And that’s where I was like, they need help, they need support so that they can get back to what their zone of genius is. Yeah, okay, we definitely need to talk about zone of genius. But before we get to that, I love what you reference about wearing all the hats. You know, early on in business, you know, we often go into what we’re doing because we have an area of expertise that people have been paying us for, and we’re being paid enough that we’re like, let’s make this the main thing we do. And the next thing you know, you’re having to, like, do accounting, which may be at your I mean, the first thing I ever did was hire an accountant. I was like, I’m not touching this with a barge pole. And I did that well before I felt ready as well. Like, I was just like, I just know this is not a good space for me to be plowing too much my energy into. 

But, you know, we’re wearing all the hats, the marketing hat, the accounting hat, the I mean, also I then learned bookkeeping, whole separate thing that the roles that I didn’t even realize weren’t one role, and actually were several roles. You know, the difference between admin and, you know, having a marketing assistant, so many different tech like, all the different things that people are having to wrap their head around and I think one of the most difficult things that I’ve seen for my clients, and even in my own journey in online business, has been that moment where you’re like, at what stage can you feel confident that now is the time to hire? And I’m going to stop there, because I was about to say, and who do you hire? But those are two separate questions.

Let’s start with when, and we’ll get to the who.  Yeah, that’s it’s a great point of differentiation, because there’s a moment, I think, as an entrepreneur, where all of a sudden you’re working in every single crack of your day, when after dinner, or while you’re cooking dinner, or on the weekends, I’m just gonna work for one hour, or on a vacation, you’re still bringing your laptop, which I’m guilty of too. But all of those things are kind of little red flags where it’s like, what is why are you still spending all of this time. You created your business for freedom. You created your business for time flexibility. And while you do love to serve and you’re passionate about it, also being able to unplug, to be able to refuel your creativity or the ideas happening in your brain is equally as important to sustain your business growth. I think the other piece that you mentioned is knowing, okay, well, I know I’m feeling this way. Now I need a unicorn. I need somebody who can do my admin and my marketing and edit my podcast, and that’s where we really kind of stop people. I stop people too, because that’s that’s not realistic, and that’s where a lot of hires will will. Yeah, I love that reflection. I myself was guilty of hiring very fast, because I went from like, I guess I was like, circling 10k months for a while, and suddenly I boomed up into like, 30k months and above. And I was suddenly like, Oh, this is a, you know, I don’t know. I just I was like, what do people do at this stage? Do they hire? And I was looking at all my peers, and I’m like, they appear to have five or six team members, and some of them were obvious and easy, like the podcast, because it’s such a tidy thing to do. Like, it’s a clear, clear role, clear deliverable. Same with accounting, clear, tidy, very minimal engagement. Aside from, you know, here are the reports you need, but hiring a VA, hiring a tech assistant, hiring a marketing assistant, those you know, and I certainly realized that it takes a while and a fair amount of attention in those early stages to kind of support people to be the best in the in the role that you’ve kind of created for them, and learning how to be a good manager.

Big learning curve. I was terrible. To be honest. I was awful. I was awful. I don’t like think about the amount of money wasted. I doubt that. But no, I It’s so true, because that’s the other kind of scary part, going from solopreneur, solo small business owner, to all of a sudden, I have to be a leader, and I have to lead this person like I don’t. I don’t. The reason I passed what I did off to them is because I don’t know how to do it, or I don’t like to do it. How am I supposed to lead them through it, and that becomes a huge stumbling block to where, I think a lot of times the business owner ends up saying, You know what, it’s just faster if I do it myself, so I’m just going to hold on to it. And then everything becomes this, like, you’re like a little squirrel collecting nuts, and you’re you don’t want to let any of them go because you’re afraid of the famine in the winter and all of these things. But really, it frees you up. I know it’s hard to to really wrap your brain around, but you, you had said, all of a sudden, when you popped up to 30k months, you were like, oh, I should hire, and that is such a beautiful revelation, because there’s the power in outsourcing or delegating then allows you to serve your clients at a much higher level. You’re able to say, oh, okay, so this onboarding process that I took my clients through when they first become coaching clients. Sally got it and Joe got it, but Jane only got little bits and pieces of it, and it wasn’t super consistent that new VA can help that process be streamlined between your business all being in your head to it being way more streamlined and efficient. And I think one of the red flags for me when I see people earlier on in business is when they say, like, oh, but you know what? I actually really like it. I do like website design. I do like learning about the tech. I do like and that to me is, you know, oftentimes, obviously, because I’ve been doing this now for five years, I look at that same person in a year or two’s time, and they’re the same person who’s like, burning their business down, questioning why they’re doing what they’re doing, sharing, like, massive meltdowns on the internet, or sometimes walking away from it altogether. And so they’ve gone from this place of, I love what I do. I love it so much I don’t want to hand any of it out. No, I’m really happy spending my weekend working for.

Husband doesn’t mind. He knows my business means a lot to me. To further down the road, the husband’s feeling pretty resentful. The kids are nagging her in the holiday saying, When are you going to spend time with me? And she’s starting to recognize all that momentum and excitement, because potentially, on the other side, she thought that will get me what I want faster, suddenly feels kind of icky, because actually doing more and doing all the things is dangerous, like from my own experience, what I’ve recognized is, when I’m tired, when I am overstretched, I put myself in more positions where I am tired and overstretched because I don’t exercise good judgment with the decisions I’m making. So it’s such I mean, so I’d love to know, from your perspective, what are the mistakes people are people making? You mentioned the one of like, you know, feeling they can do all the things and keep keeping it all on their shoulders. But for those people who potentially, maybe are listening to this right now and they’re thinking, You know what, I tried to hire a VA and it went horribly wrong. What would you say? You know, what would you say the common mistakes people make when they do start trying to hire?

It’s such a great question. The first thing that I do with my clients is we like the very first exercise we do before we even talk about hiring, is we do a time and task audit, and so we go through everything that they’re working on. We go through how frequently they work on it, and we talk about how it affects their energy and how efficient they are at it, right? Just because you can do something, or you know how to do something doesn’t mean you should be doing it right. Like that’s that’s a big thing. Now, if you truly enjoy doing it, that’s different. I had a client, huge influencer. I mean, she had over 100,000 followers. She loved being in her DM. She loved being in her direct message. And we were like, this isn’t the best use of your time, but for her, it felt like such a connection point to her audience. She was able to still connect with her audience. So she was in her DM all the time. We were like, Okay, we’re not going to take that from you. And so there’s a difference between being able to do it and truly enjoying doing it, or it being a good use of your unique gifts. If you’re a connector, if you’re a networker, keep the DM because it keeps you tapped into your ideal client. If you can do your website, but you’re not a tech person.

No, we’re gonna outsource that eventually. Like also, I would say the other kind of piece that I really try and hone in on with my clients is, what do you find yourself procrastinating on regularly? Is it recording your socials. Is it writing captions for socials? What are you finding yourself procrastinating on? Because that’s often an indicator of what’s overwhelming for you, what you’re avoiding, what you don’t love to do. So those pieces really make a big difference as well. So I would say, like, really that time and task audit gives us a really clear indication into, yeah, well, no, I love to hand off first about what you’re saying, Kate is, I feel like a lot of people, to a certain extent, might know on principle, some of these things. But how many of them can actually also honestly say, hand on heart, that they are fully aware of where all their hours are going, what their most valuable tasks are, and to be genuinely aware of what the value of their hour is. You know, I sat with a client yesterday where we ascertained that she was making she was actually only making 120 pounds an hour. She she thought it was 250 but I also said, Well, how much does your VA cost you currently? She was like, 25 pounds an hour. So I was like, okay, so even where we’re looking to increase the value of your hour, you’re still making like, almost five times what you’re paying her. So when you’re thinking about delegating, you know, that’s a huge opportunity there. But, you know, I think a lot of us don’t necessarily have the discipline to sit down and do this work, and that’s where working with somebody like you, I can see, you know, set so strong foundations, like, I’m thinking about a lemon, and being like, you’re hiring the lemon, the VA, but we’re gonna get all the juice out of that hire when we actually approach it strategically, and the majority of us don’t come with the experience to really understand how to do these things, from the whole even knowing what to ask for, knowing how to actually have the conversation, to find the right match to then actually.

On board them. Like, I mean, can we talk about all the pieces of what it actually looks like to hire somebody? Because I think again, sometimes people just think, I don’t know, like a VA just kind of comes out of thin air, and they just slot in and know what to do. But what does it actually look like when you hire. Exactly?

Yeah, so it’s a great question, because you are exactly right in that when people say, Oh, I’ve hired before, and it didn’t work out, it’s usually because people tend to say, I hired a VA, everything is fixed now, and everything’s gonna go, Well, I’m just gonna hand it all off. But if you don’t have a clear understanding of what you’re even handing off, or how you want it done, or how you will measure their success, it’s going to fail. And so kind of after that time and task audit that I go through, we start to take a look and say, Okay, these are the top five things. Will kind of group things together, and we’ll create a job description that is comprehensive, that makes sense, that it’s going to be one, one individual, not somebody who’s a math brain and a tech brain and a social media brain, because that’s going to be a different, different role. And then we go through the hiring interviewing, vetting process, I like to use a lot of personality assessments, if those are available for either the client and the VA, because so much of hiring before you even get to training and onboarding is cultural fit for Your organization as well. So yes, skills are extremely important, and also the cultural fit somebody who aligns with who you are, who you’re serving, how you show up, your business’s core values. That to me, I would take almost any day over skills, because for the right person, you can almost always train a skill.

I hired one VA and within a month, because there just wasn’t, yeah, she wasn’t that I could see from her lack of motivation, her lack of communication, that she just wasn’t a good fit. And I was very fortunate to, up until that point, have hired highly motivated, highly kind of enthusiastic, really had my back and like were excited for my business kind of teams and team members. So when I hired someone who was not like that, it stood out immediately. But I also really like what you’re sharing there in case, in case, I could like share from, share from what learn from all the mistakes I’ve made. But one thing I also recognized at one point when I looked at my team was that I had hired a lot of people that I would like to go down the pub with, but,

but there was also an element where I had to also recognize that I am very creative, very ADHD, a visionary. I don’t say very ADHD. That’s not true. But I am ADHD, so I can, you know, I think through talking, I’m always having new ideas get sometimes getting a bit excited and impulsive about those new ideas that part of me is slowed down as I’ve kind of leaned into being a better CEO. I’ve recognized how that was not helping me in the earlier stages. But what I had to recognize at one point with hiring is when I went to hire my most recent admin assistant. Admin assistant, Kim, who listens to this podcast. So if you’re listening, Kim, love you. But one of the things about Kim is she thinks very differently. To me, she’s very methodic and very organized and very you know, she’s she loves ticking a box. And so at first I was like, well, Kim and I are quite different. And I was like, and that’s exactly why I need Kim to come in, because we share the same values. I absolutely we both love each other to bits. We have a really good relationship, but we think differently, and that was actually a really eye opening moment for me when I had to recognize Polly. It’s not always just about getting people who think like you, because actually when you’re building an organization, you also need the people who think in a different way so they can see the things that you can’t see, even if that can feel quite confronting at times, like Kim’s very good at helping me recognize when I’m spiraling off into an idea that was not planned. And I love her for that. You know, I wouldn’t be without that. So I think that was also a kind of grown up moment in my business where I was like, oh, okay, need to kind of,

it’s so true, right? Like having that counterbalance to to what you’re as you are the visionary. You are the person who’s who started the business. You’re the excited, quick, moving ideas. I can see all the magic happening, and then having the counterbalance to that, like him being able to say, okay, what are the priorities we need to implement? Right? Like and that’s also where. That’s also where and why I like to use personality assessments, because it helps me to further corroborate.

Rate what somebody’s saying about themselves on a resume, somebody is or a CV, right? Somebody is saying, Oh, I’m really organized on paper, or I love checking a box off, or I’m a fast mover. What is their personality assessment? That kind of unbiased tool right? Now, I’m, I’m working with a luxury real estate agent, and I’m we have interviews for her today, and I’ve used personality assessments to help understand how that counterbalance will work in the relationship, because she is like you, where she moves quickly, she sees all the possibilities. She needs somebody who’s going to help her take what she’s dreaming of and take it that kind of final mile, and make sure it’s actually finished and seen all the way through. And so that’s where those I kind of come in with my chaos to Kim and say, Kim, can you remember this for me? And she, you know, organizes all those things that I really struggle to do. I couldn’t be without her. So if you’re listening again, Kim, love you. But yeah, so I love I said there’s so many pieces here that I just think people don’t have an awareness around the personality test, the kind of understanding the value of the tasks, understanding the value of time. And I do think it’s really common earlier, even later on in business, to be honest with you, where we can just be so in our habits, we’re habitual by nature, right as humans, and so we don’t necessarily think about where we may be draining our time and energy and where there’s the opportunity to make more money. And I think one of the things I found that came to my mind while listening to you is about the limiting beliefs sometimes we can have around hiring, and how our decision to hire or not hire can also be a reflection of potentially, a lack of trust that we can make the money that justifies the higher

Yes, yes, 100% and so I think not only The trust in handing what you’ve built over to somebody else and trusting that they will support it and care for it with the same level of respect that you have and all the all the effort, blood, sweat and tears that have gone into it, for sure, I think the trust is a huge piece. And yes, absolutely, the the um, almost the scarcity mindset of,

Am I going to be able to recoup what I spend on this VA? And like you were talking about with your client earlier, she pays her va 25 pounds an hour. She makes 125 or 120 an hour, I think you said, and so she’s automatically opening herself up. Here you do this, and it gives your client an extra hour to not only recoup but make that additional money. Because previously, she didn’t have that ability, she didn’t have that extra hour, because now she’s handing it off. Now she’s opened herself up to more possibility, more potential, and so I think that is a we often need to talk through, that scarcity piece, that piece that says, I don’t want to share my money. I don’t want to share my resources. I’m not making enough. But really, it opens you up to make more, which feels weird, feels counterintuitive, because you’re paying somebody else, and also it allows you to get even more focus. I mean, the other thing I found funny is that it’s very confronting about where we are lacking boundaries. Because when you look at where your time’s going, and like you say, there’s some things like that your client who likes sending DMS where there’s an element of and if that’s what brings you joy in your business, and it’s you know, it’s working in its own way, then you know you can allow that to be there. But also it’s on those things that maybe in a few months time, she may reconsider if she then recognizes, but it at least puts a kind of magnifying glass on it. And I know, certainly for me, there are little things where I definitely, I mean, we all do, right? It’s a work in progress. I do it a lot less than I did earlier on in business, but there are still always areas, and we all know, I mean, I talk about the five revenue levers that help us make more money in business. One is volume of leads. Another one is increasing your prices, but one of them on that list is efficiency. And everything we’re talking about here is about increasing your efficiency, which, to be honest with you, it’s a foundational piece, because if you haven’t got the efficiency dialed in, you’re just going to be scaling chaos, right? In fact, I think you did a great reel around that.

Exactly, yes, exactly I did. I talked about how it was kind of this position of, when you hire a VA, you can’t just randomly throw things at them. That’s just delegating chaos, right? And. So you have to be able to say, okay, and this is why we start with the time and task audit, because then we have a very clear understanding of what we’re handing off. First what we need to build really simple checklists around to be able to hand to the new assistant, and then that assistant has a foundation to continue building from and streamlining or creating more efficiencies around. They can say, Okay, this is how you’ve been doing it. This is how we can automate it, or this is how we can amazing, tighten it up, provide a better experience.

Tell me more about the onboarding part, if anyone’s listening thinking. But what does that actually look like? Because I imagine some of them might be thinking because, because, also, I think people underestimate the kind of the enormity, really of it, and quite how expansive and how deep you you’d be going supporting somebody with this transition. So what does it look like?

Yeah, absolutely. I have a 90 day one on one coaching program that I take my clients through. And so we start at that time and task audit, and we wrap it up at the very end of their onboarding and training with their VA. And so typically, if everything goes according to plan you, the first 30 days is time and task audit, creating the job description and getting it out into the world. And the second part of that process is vetting the candidates that come in, interviewing and creating an offer to to make to the VA that we end up selecting. And then the final process, which I think is the most important part of the process, is that onboarding and training. And so within this 90 day container, I have so many templates that I’ve created to help start your your SOP library. I have indexes, I have templates, I have how to delegate, right like here’s a checklist that you’re going to go through every time you pass a new task off to your virtual assistant. That is a pivotal part of stepping into that leadership curve for you and make sure that your virtual assistant, your new assistant, is on the same page, so that you both know this is the task that’s getting handed off. This is why it matters. These are the steps that I’ve taken in the past to do it. These are the pieces that you will need to complete this task. It needs to be done by this date. This is the priority. Here are the metrics. That surround it. So that way, as you right out of the gate, you are both on the same page. You know what you’re being judged by, you know what you’re handing off, and then it’s returned to you in a way that feels helpful. I mean, I really like that. Like one of the phrases that people have probably heard time and time again, is hire slow, fire fast. And one of the reasons why someone said to me, how do you hire fire your VA so easily. And I’m like, well, obviously, emotionally, it didn’t feel great. But one of the things that made it a lot easier was she did come in with very clear, you know, tasks, very clear, measurable outcomes, very clear kind of expectations. So it was a very easy conversation to essentially say none of these things are being met or like barely and so it was an easy thing to let go of, but I would have avoided that entirely had I actually not done what a lot of us do, which was thinking, I need an extra VA. I just want these tasks off my plate as soon as possible. Didn’t give it really enough thought, and so hired quickly, not slowly, and what you shared about vetting, I think a lot of people get very overwhelmed at that stage and don’t necessarily know what it is that they’re even vetting for. So the fact that in 90 days, you’re kind of creating this kind of blueprint for hiring moving forward, and a deeper understanding as to their operational efficiency, which, like I say, is so pivotal, because I’ve seen what happens to businesses that are led with chaos and led with one person trying to, you know, manage all the pieces. And, like I say, what you said at the very beginning of this conversation about burnout, that is a very valid risk. And I think the challenge with burnout is a lot of us don’t necessarily see it. We’ll see all the symptoms of it. We’ll say, Oh, I’m I hate my clients right now. I, you know, I’m really tired of it. I’m really fed up that this client has me working on the weekend. Or, why? Why is my website never working for me? Why I’m fed up with WordPress or, you know, like, oh, actually, I think I’m going to go on LinkedIn. Because sometimes I wonder if sometimes I wonder if I even want to be doing this anymore. And it’s those are all the little, kind of sneaky signs that the way you’re running your business isn’t isn’t serving you and and I just think people massively underestimate they’ll go work with a business coach who doesn’t go to this level of forensic depth that you’re going to.

You, nobody’s true. I know one of the reasons why I had to have you on this podcast. So for full transparency, Kate is inside my accelerator, but I wanted Kate to have this conversation with me on the show, because I think it’s something that people massively underestimate, where they’re losing a lot of money, you know, because they’re not getting the full ROI on their hire. Oftentimes they’re actually losing money from that hire, because it’s not and then it also leaves them with the story of, I don’t trust myself to hire. I don’t trust anyone can do it as well as me. I don’t trust I really understand how to delegate, so I’m not going to do it at all. And it just leaves you in this either in a circle of shame or carrying the weight of some hires that are not doing the work for you, and the idea that within 90 days you can clean all that up and come out the other side with way cleaner processes in place. I mean, even, like most people, I talk to them, they talk about SOPs. They’re like, where do I begin? Where do I store them? What does that even look like? And they often assume, Oh, that’s something you do later on, when you’re scaling when actually what I’ve like, one of the things I think put me ahead of the game and helped me grow faster was that I was treating that like a non negotiable well before it felt like a necessity. You know, like, and so similarly, the work you do, it’s something that people might be like, oh, yeah, that’s something I’ll come back to in a year, but chances are you need to do it now. The person who’s like listening to this and thinking, Kate, I think, I don’t know, do I need to do this now? What would your invitation be?

That be to them, if you need to do this now, yes, you probably need, if you’re questioning, if you need to validate, valid saving around, isn’t it? You’re thinking about it, you probably should, because it’s a waste of energy, wondering, right? Like, exactly, but I do have, I have an AI prompt for solo business owners that is a like, I like to give it to my assistant, right chat, GPT, or whatever, AI tool that you use, but it’s an unbiased tool that helps you really recognize right out of the gate where your time is going and what can be automated, what could be delegated, and what you need to just stop doing altogether. And so I’ve got this fabulous tool. If you are interested in that, I think I will show Polly’s going to include it in the show notes and get a free 15 minute call with me after you’ve completed the AI prompt you get to, we get to hop on a call and go over any results that are like, wait. So what should I do about that, because I think, I think the other thing to your point, Polly, is like these solo business owners that are starting to feel burnout, that are like, Okay, I do need to hand some part of this off. Hiring feels daunting, because it takes so much time, and so this forensic level that I go to, we build in kind of secret pieces into the job description, into the interview process that help us vet before we even get on the interview, for communication, for like grammar, for whatever is important to you. We build that into the interview process, and then we also really talk about what’s what’s non-negotiable for you, how, how you’re going to show up before we even interview. I get on the interviews with you like it’s just so so that you have a partner with you to help boost your confidence in who you’re bringing. I’m obsessed with this. I think it’s yeah, just so so needed and and I just yeah, like I say, I’m just so glad we’ve had this conversation today. I hope it’s triggered some exciting and inspiring thoughts for our listeners. Thank you, Kate, so much for your time. As mentioned, all the all these wonderful links will be in the show notes, so make sure you capitalize on it, because honestly, the sooner you get support, the sooner you have what I am very passionate about, which is having a business that can be on when you are off. You know, we’re approaching the summer right now as we’re recording. This is obviously valid any time of year, but particularly as I feel the heat rising and wanting to be outside more. I can’t tell you how wonderful it is for me to know that even when I’m chilling out in the park with my kids, that you know if someone’s reaching out asking a question, my lovely assistant, Kim is there to support them. If a payments been missed, Kim’s on it. If someone’s booking something in the diary, Kim’s sorting it out for me. If you know podcasts are being recorded and produced, well, I’m just kind of sat there painting my nails. It’s such a game changer, and really enables you to, kind of, you can just get ill without thinking what’s going to happen to my business. So, and this is where it all starts, with the kind of work you’d be doing with Kate. So yeah, big fan. Big fan. Thank you, Kate, so much for your time today. Thank you.

Thank you so much for sharing me with your audience. I hope that this conversation provided such value, and I continue serving you.

Well, what did you make of that? Food for thought, if you want to explore how Kate can support you, the links are in the show notes, as always. And you know, honestly, I’m just so happy you’re getting to hear this today, because if there’s one really expensive mistake I’ve ever made in my business, the majority of those mistakes have all been around hiring.

And if I could go back in time, I wish I’d had a Kate in my life to support me to understand these things before I had to learn them all the hard way. So yeah, fabulous conversation. I’ll be back in your ears and next week with a solo episode continuing the theme of summer sales and sales over summer, I will be in your is then, as always, if you found this episode helpful, if you’re thinking about that friend of yours who’s constantly showing up late, constantly missing barbecues on the weekend to work over the weekend, or who’s constantly complaining about their VA take this as your sign to go and share this either in your stories or directly with them, because the more people who can learn all this good stuff and access this podcast, the better. And I’ll be so grateful to you for helping me spread the word. I’ll be in your ears next week.